Third Eye Film Society Forum Index
Author Message

<  Third Eye Archives - Specialty Forums  ~  Directors Series - Federico Fellini

censored-03
Posted: Sat May 07, 2005 1:06 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 24 May 2004 Posts: 3058 Location: Gotham, Big Apple, The Naked City
bocce wrote:
Quote:
can i suggest we move along to LA STRADA on monday...
That was the plan. If folks want to discuss Il Bidone and the trilogy of loneliness which it is in the middle of (the other two being I Vitelloni and La Strada) I have no problem with that. But, with the interest of keeping this forum a bit streamlined and to move it into Fellini's more well known phase, I think we'll just keep the first 6 as is.

La Strada Monday, I know this is an easy film to obtain, so good viewing!

_________________
"Life is a comedy for those who think and a tragedy for those who feel."
-- Horace Walpole
View user's profile Send private message
ehle64
Posted: Sat May 07, 2005 1:59 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 7149 Location: NYC; US&A
Try and rent the Criterion release, though. It's a double-disc set that features a LOT of goodies and extras. Including a made-for-Italian-TV documentary called Federico Fellini's Autobiography.

_________________
It truly disappoints me when people do something for you via no prompt of your own and then use it as some kind of weapon against you at a later time and place. It is what it is.
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
burritoboy
Posted: Mon May 09, 2005 11:04 am Reply with quote
Joined: 14 Apr 2005 Posts: 17 Location: Chicago
"censored...

as you suggested i dug a little further and found this:

"A film movement that lasted from 1942 to 1952. Even though critics credit Roberto Rossellini's 1945 Roma Citta Aperta (Rome Open City) as being the first truly neo-realist film, Luchino Visconti's Ossessione (1942, Obsession) was really the herald of this movement. And in fact, the scriptwriter of Visconti's film, Antonio Pietrangeli, coined the term neo-realism in 1943 when talking about Ossessione. The main exponents of this movement are Visconti, Rossellini and Vittorio De Sica."

so i guess "neo realism" wasn't, in fact, a post war tag which blows another of my misconceptions. i date any given movement to the time it is named so i'll have to back away from my earlier stance."

Many people point to Renoir's "La Nuit du carrefour" (1932) and "Toni" (1935) as precursors to neo-realism.
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Marilyn
Posted: Mon May 09, 2005 11:14 am Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 8210 Location: Skokie (not a bad movie, btw)
This is what Fellini had to say about neorealism:

Quote:
I have already said that I identify neorealism primarily with Roberto Rossellini. The other father of neorealism was Cesare Zavattini. He is a poet, a copious source of ideas, invention and new perspectives. The collaboration between Zavattini and Vittorio De Sica yielded much fruit: Sciuscia, Bicycle Thieves, Umberto D., Miracle in Milan. If I remember correctly, Miracle in Milan appeared in the same year as Rossellini's The Flowers of Saint Francis, which represented a decisive stage in the development of neorealism.

Up until then the movement had been a spontaneous impulse to view reality with disenchanted and liberated eyes, a way of taking stock of the contemporary world. Now what was needed was knowledge of humanity, by turning those same eyes upon the inner man. The Flowers of Saint Francis was step in this direction, leading the way for Rossellini's later films, culminated with General Della Rovere. Neorealism pretended to derive directly from life, but life transforms itself incessantly. Rossellini had the sensitivity always to keep in tune with the shiting wavelength of real life, even it if meant contradicting his theoretical principles. But neorealism was exploited somewhat excessively, even for purely commenrcial reasons. If there hadn't been this exploitation, we would all call ourselves neorealists today.

_________________
http://ferdyonfilms.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Kate
Posted: Mon May 09, 2005 11:26 am Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 1397 Location: Pacific Northwest
I watched IV last night and come somewhere in between Lady W and Marc. Unlike many of you, I am not a film critic to the extent that I don’t deconstruct films for any other reason than whether I am moved by them in any given direction. So with that I can say that I was not particularly interested in these men’s lives. Like Censored I was struck with how old they were, and I actually found that to be distracting. I think that may be due to having first seen all the films it inspired, particularly American Graffiti. Those guys to too damn old to be screwing around doing nothing. I am sure this was not unusual for the times, but for whatever reason, it detracted from the film for me. Then, Fausto was such a bastard I couldn’t stand him and like Lady said, wanted to reach in and smack him.

Having said all that, I did enjoy the both the opening scene and the carnival – Fellini really captured the love of the crowd and can see why people love his films.

I look forward to La Strada.
View user's profile Send private message
Ghulam
Posted: Mon May 09, 2005 12:24 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 4742 Location: Upstate NY
La Strada is a beautiful love story. (spoilers) It would not appear to be so in view of Zampano's abuse of and cruelty to Gelsomina, and the fact that Gelsomina tries to run away from him more than once. When she does lose him, she loses her mind and dies soon after. He does not realise how much he was in love with her and how much he missed her until after he loses her. While Fellini's realism comes through in every scene, the story as well as the characters are set more in the classical than in the realistic mode. Such characters are to be found in Othello or A Midsummer Night's Dream, rather than in Bicycle Thieves.
View user's profile Send private message
lady wakasa
Posted: Mon May 09, 2005 1:30 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 21 May 2004 Posts: 5911 Location: Beyond the Blue Horizon
melisb wrote:
this is from a few days back, but hey, i've only gotten here.

lady wakasa, bordwell (and thompson) have two major books: film art (more like a film dictionary) and film history. while nice, they're too much of the textbook variety to sit back and enjoy. instead, i'd recommend the oxford history of world cinema (ed. nowell-smith) for essays that combine history and some theory, and oxford guide to film studies (ed.s hill and church-gibson) for an overview of pretty much all film theory. it'll give you a more general idea, so then you can go out and read the more specific theory texts, which usually come in handy collections like film theory and criticism (ed.s mast, cohen, braudy), film theory (ed.s stam and miller) or movies and methods (vol. 1-2, ed. nichols). hope that helps.

i'm back. or at least i'll try to be, since fellini's one of my all-time favorites.


Thanks, Mel - I missed this when you posted it, but I'm in the library right now and will see if I can find the Oxford as a start (and so they'll validate my parking ticket).

It's a beautiful day not to be at work - too bad I'm supposed to be home writing business letters (having just finished fitness training).
View user's profile Send private message
censored-03
Posted: Mon May 09, 2005 2:55 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 24 May 2004 Posts: 3058 Location: Gotham, Big Apple, The Naked City
Welcome to the wonderful world of Giulietta Masina and La Strada.
On the Criterion version DVD that ehle mentioned (maybe other versions as well) you can watch La Strada in it's normally screened (in America) Italian w/ subtitles or you can see an English dubbed version with the American actors Anthony Quinn and Richard Basehart speaking in their own language. The only problem with this is that Masina and others are obviously over-dubbed and you don't quite get the same ryhthm that you probably should with the original Italian language, it is interesting though.

_________________
"Life is a comedy for those who think and a tragedy for those who feel."
-- Horace Walpole
View user's profile Send private message
bocce
Posted: Mon May 09, 2005 3:27 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 24 May 2004 Posts: 2428
fellini had an affinity for foreign actors early in his career...

perhaps he felt they were better trained (as italy in the war years was somewhat sparce of actor's studios) but i think it was to add a subtlety with the clash of cultures that might enhance a performance and, thus, the film.

this is, of course, idle speculation (sort of).

there is an obvious non italianate look to baseheart (the fool) and later in IL BIDONE which sets him apart not only characteristically, but physically.
View user's profile Send private message
Melody
Posted: Mon May 09, 2005 5:54 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 2242 Location: TX
Kate wrote:
Those guys [are] too damn old to be screwing around doing nothing. I am sure this was not unusual for the times, but for whatever reason, it detracted from the film for me.

Had to laugh at that, Kate. I had the same wife/mother reaction as you -- these guys are 30 years old and just now holding down their first jobs?? I chalked it up to Italian (middle class?) culture, the era, etc., but yeah, it nagged at me, too.

I wonder if audiences of the time were shocked that the drunk guy's sister ran away from her responsibilities? I was cheering her on, but also curious as to how "real" that situation was.

_________________
My heart told my head: This time, no.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
jeremy
Posted: Tue May 10, 2005 12:36 am Reply with quote
Joined: 21 May 2004 Posts: 6794 Location: Derby, England and Hamilton, New Zealand (yes they are about 12,000 miles apart)
http://film.guardian.co.uk/news/story/0,12589,1479564,00.html

Three tales of La Dolce Vita dip in fountain.

_________________
I am angry, I am ill, and I'm as ugly as sin.
My irritability keeps me alive and kicking.
I know the meaning of life, it doesn't help me a bit.
I know beauty and I know a good thing when I see it.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
marantzo
Posted: Tue May 10, 2005 8:54 am Reply with quote
Guest
I haven't seen I Vitelloni in many many years, but the age of the slackers bothering some is puzzling to me. Isn't that the point of the film? These guys aren't kids but they still haven't got out of adolescence. Doesn't the title of the movie itself pretty well say that. If they were 18-20 year olds it wouldn't be a very unusual depiction of these types because at that age it is a common way of living a young life.

When I first saw La Strada back in the 60's I wasn't a great fan of it. I found it a bit grim and unrelenting. After re-watching it yesterday I appreciated it much more. There is some wonderful camera work that I didn't remember, Rota's music that is in a world of its own (as usual) and Masina, who impressed me the first time but absolutely floored me this time. She has a face that is unforgettable in its innocence and vulnerability. She uses her looks and stature to create a character that tears your heart to shreds. She never overplays, she mostly underplays and it is transcendant. Her little performances (which I had forgetten about) while assisting Quinn with his threadbare act are absolute gems. She does that little dance one time and with just a few little steps and kicks is just a delight to behold. Of course when you first see her (and the hats) Chaplin immediately comes to mind. It's obvious and not something that there is any attempt to camouflage, but I soon was witnessing less of Chaplin and more of Stan Laurel. Has anyone made this comparison?

I'll write more later, but just had to vent my adoration of Masina's performance.
Marilyn
Posted: Tue May 10, 2005 9:00 am Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 8210 Location: Skokie (not a bad movie, btw)
I have not rewatched La Strada yet, but it seems that the film was written with Masina in mind, that her character was a parallel with Giulietta. Fellini must have felt very badly about the way he ran around on her.

_________________
http://ferdyonfilms.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
marantzo
Posted: Tue May 10, 2005 9:46 am Reply with quote
Guest
Fellini must have felt very badly about the way he ran around on her.

I don't know if you are being sarcastic or not, but in case you are serious, I wouldn't think that it bothered him all that much. I could very well be wrong. He goes into this very subject in Juliet of the Spirits, but I can't remember if he feels much guilt about the dalliances. From what I remember he is rather cold hearted about it. It's also been a very long time since I've seen this movie so my memory may be incorrect. He doesn't seem to be too bothered about his affairs in 8 1/2 either. He seems mostly perturbed that they are causing him problems in his marriage than actually feeling bad about how he is cheating on his wife. I don't want to sound nationalist, but from what I've gathered it seems to be an Italian thing. The cavalier attitude toward infidelity.
Marilyn
Posted: Tue May 10, 2005 9:53 am Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 8210 Location: Skokie (not a bad movie, btw)
Italians don't really have a cavalier attitude toward infidelity. It causes a lot of pain, and Fellini knows this. He probably just didn't care all that much, as you say. I would have to say, though, that La Strada may betray his feelings more than you think.

_________________
http://ferdyonfilms.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website

Display posts from previous:  

All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 12 of 55
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 11, 12, 13 ... 53, 54, 55  Next
This forum is locked: you cannot post, reply to, or edit topics.

Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum