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gromit |
Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:56 am |
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Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 9010
Location: Shanghai
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I didn't dislike No Country 4OM, but was a bit disappointed. Some of it felt like re-tread Coens. Kelly Macdonald using the same cadence and speech patterns as Holly Hunter in O Brother and Raising Arizona. Chigurh as the ultimate unstoppable bad-ass like Leonard Smalls in RA, although this time he drifts away undefeated.
The clerks all with that trademark Coen laconic drawl, and the back-and-forth dialogue that goes nowhere.
I can see the Mexico point.
I understood Woody's role, just not the point of it, since he ends up so easy to dispose of.
I didn't really get a feel of what Chigurh's philosophy was. Or that he much had one. I wonder if anyone who saw the movie without reading the book got a sense of what he believed. Except he does say that he keeps his word in the scene with Carla Jean.
(tangent: the coin toss stuff reminded me of John Barth's The Floating Opera where the narrator decides to commit suicide based on a coin toss. But then when according to the coin toss he should off himself as he's been preparing, he decides that it's foolish to let a coin decide his fate, so he does the opposite (and ironically letting the coin decide his fate).
It also seemed strange to me that Chigurh was so sloppy. He was captured once, gets shot, gets in an accident, and does all sorts of killing and violence in public places, frequently in daylight. The whole procuring of medicine from the pharmacy and self-surgery was gripping, but seemed rather implausible. And wouldn't it just be easier to plan ahead and have a first aid kit with needles, painkillers, etc, before being severely wounded and needing them?
If I want to see TommY lee Jones and dead bodies along the Tex-Mex border, I might opt for The Three Burials of Melquiades Estrada instead. |
Last edited by gromit on Thu Jan 31, 2008 3:06 am; edited 3 times in total _________________ Killing your enemies, if it's done badly, increases their number. |
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lady wakasa |
Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:04 am |
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Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 5911
Location: Beyond the Blue Horizon
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gromit wrote: It also seemed strange to me that Chigurh was so sloppy. He was captured once, gets shot, gets in an accident, and does all sorts of killing and violence in public places, frequently in daylight. The whole procuring of medicine from the pharmacy and self-surgery was gripping, but seemed rather implausible. And wouldn't it just be easier to plan ahead and have a first aid kit with needles, painkillers, etc, before being severely wounded and needing them?
I think that's the first time someone actually managed to knick him (Chigurrh), and it came as a surprise. As it turns out, Moss is the only person (that we know of) who has managed to stand up to him at all, and is on Chigurrh's list but Chigurrh doesn't manage to eliminate.
The arrest thing was definitely a self-test (at least in the book). The accident was just that - someone else goofs up and hits him, he was "following the rules" - and actually points out the whole chance / fate thing running through the movie. And his daylight murders are out in the middle of nowhere, with no witnesses (unless I'm forgetting something). It's not like the Mexicans offing Moss in a motel parking lot in broad daylight in the middle of El Paso - and even they had to hightail it out of there.
Yes, I've seen this twice and read the book. I really really love the structure of the storytelling (among other things).
EDIT: I think there's more of a sense in the book that Chigurrh's a loose cannon, which is why The Business Man sends more people after the money and Wells after Chigurrh. He is leaving a bloody swathe through the rural Texas border, and The Business Man is interested in keeping their profile low. |
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chillywilly |
Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:55 am |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 8251
Location: Salt Lake City
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SPOILAGE CONTINUES
tirebiter wrote: 1) his conscience was eating at him. Maybe it was dumb (and he realized before going that it very likely was), but he felt he had to go.
This was also made clear when his wife asked him what he was doing as he was heading out the door with a gallon jug of water and he said he knew it was something dumb and that if he didn't come back, to tell his mama he loved her (which his wife's response was "she's already dead")
tirebiter wrote: 4) Woody's character is a fixer like Chigurh, probably contacted at the same place Stephen Root found Chigurh when his drug deal went bad. He figured it would take an SOB to track down an SOB, and he was right. Everyone underestimates Chigurh's lethality, tho, and they ALL die for their mistake, with the exception of TLJ, who backs off in the face of such mystery and power.
Well stated. I thought Woody's character was sent to be the tough guy to try and collect the money and to try his luck at outsmarting Chigurh, which obviously he failed.
END SPOILERS |
_________________ Chilly
"If you should die before me / Ask if you could bring a friend" |
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Syd |
Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:00 pm |
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Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 12921
Location: Norman, Oklahoma
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Cloverfield has a great concept and runs with it. What if we had a home-movie type tape of the destruction of Manhattan by a giant monster as in Godzilla. In other words, one of those little people running around in the street has a shakycam and films his entire experience, including the effort of his friend and a couple of comrades to rescue the friend's girlfriend. The actors are relative unknowns and do quite well. My favorite was Lizzy Caplan as the brave Marlena, who is unable to explain why she is helping a guy she has met csaually three times rescue a girl she hardly knows (if she knew her at all).
The result will induce motion sickness in some viewers and frustrate others, but for me it worked spectacularly well. Like The Blair Witch Project, you get a closeup of terror, and it managed to scare me as well. It really helps that you only get to see parts of the monster during most of the movie and your mind gets to fill in the rest, and the monster is weird. The shoulders are what got to me. Shoulders shouldn't work that way.
I'm amazed that somebody found a fresh approach to the giant-monster-destroys-great-city genre and pleased that it works so well. |
_________________ I had a love and my love was true but I lost my love to the yabba dabba doo, --The Flintstone Lament |
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billyweeds |
Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:41 pm |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 20618
Location: New York City
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Very happy to see that others are joining me in proclaiming Ratatouille overrated. Most don't dislike it to the degree I do, but Jeremy's description is right on the money.
Love the deconstruction of NCFOM. All points well taken. |
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Rod |
Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:18 pm |
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Joined: 21 Dec 2004
Posts: 2944
Location: Lithgow, Australia
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jeremy wrote: Rod,
I always assumed you were already an English graduate of some sort.
No, just a terminal smart-aleck. You can call this something of an intellectual stalling tactic.
Quote: I have just finished reading the second installment Clive James' autobiography, Falling Towards England. Already a graduate from Sydney something or other, the book deals with the rather feckless period of his life spent in London prior to his gettng his 'stuff' together and going to Cambridge. From there he went on to...well to be Clive James.
I wonder how he views his career. I think his first love was poetry, but he never achieved much recognition for this - who does these days. Where I thnk he deserves recognition is in essentially reinventing television criticism during his time spent at The Observer in the seventies - he was one of the first to understand the place of popular culture in the arts and give it its due. In comparison, I think his later forays into tele were a disappointment.
His autobiographies were great reads, if a little heavy on the self-deprecation.
Any parallels Rod?
Not really. Some people might describe my life as feckless, but no-one who actually knows me does - I've worked very hard most of the time. I first got on the map with a big grant when I was 19 and haven't been able to replicate that success yet. I had to fight very hard to get through a creative crisis in the past few years and now I've been somewhat ignominiously pushed at the back of the queue in my career. Which, in the ironic way of such things, has made me much more persistent.
And having read some of James' poetry I'll just say he makes a great TV critic. |
_________________ A long time ago, but somehow in the future...It is a period of civil war and renegade paragraphs floating through space. |
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inlareviewer |
Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:48 am |
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Joined: 05 Jul 2004
Posts: 1949
Location: Lawrence, KS
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I found Ratatouille unexpectedly delightful, No Country for Old Men ineffably masterful, both of them wonderful. Chacun à son goût. |
_________________ "And take extra care with strangers/Even flowers have their dangers/And though scary is exciting/Nice is different than good." --Stephen Sondheim |
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Ghulam |
Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 2:28 am |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 4742
Location: Upstate NY
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The French movie Lady Chatterley starring Marina Hands is based on a lesser known version of D.H.Lawrence' novel, and is a very mature treatment of the subject. It deals seriously with issues such as living as a paraplegic, living with a paraplegic, guilt-free commitment to a sexual relationship and the liberating effect of such a relationship. The complexity of the three main characters is well developed. The movie runs at a leisurely pace, is beautifully photographed, and deals with the sexual encounters in a tasteful manner. It won five Cesars, including Best Picture and Best Actress. |
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gromit |
Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 3:52 am |
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Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 9010
Location: Shanghai
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Juno is a very good film, and settles firmly in my Top 10 of the year.
Ellen Page is engaging and there's a good deal of verve underpinning the film.
One thing interesting is how all of the relationships are female-dominated. Very clear with Juno and mild-mannered Bleeker, controlling Vanessa and hubby, but also the step-mom seems the strong force vs. Dad, though that's a little more even.
It was a bit over-written at times. Especially the clerk early in the film during the pregnancy test, but also step-mom's dressing down the ultra-sound technician. I didn't have a problem with Juno, as that could just be her style. But the scene where her and Dad go to meet the prospective adopters seemed rather phony. Sure there can be false bravado, but generally 16 year olds know how to act appropriately, or at least sullenly keep quiet, when parents and other adults are around and serious business is being transacted.
Minor Spoilage:
Quote: I like the way how we perceive Vanessa as maybe unstable or harboring some problem, while the hubby is portrayed as nice and normal. And then the switch happens, that Vanessa really is the reliable stable one, and the hubby can't handle his role.
I do think it would be an infinitely more difficult choice to be pregnant in high school than the film presents. It also seemed strange that slightly arty/weird girl Juno would be best friends with Miss Cheerleader -- which was highly reminiscent of American Beauty. Also Bleeker was a little too much of a wet noodle it seemed.
I got a bit of a Wes Anderson vibe from the film, especially the recurring runners and the twee music. Anyway, Juno gets these opposable thumbs in parallel vertical position.
Edit: forgot to mention that my two thumbs went up becausemy index fingers needed to rub my teary eyes when we got the hospital scenes.
Edited for emotional truth. |
Last edited by gromit on Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:41 am; edited 1 time in total _________________ Killing your enemies, if it's done badly, increases their number. |
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whiskeypriest |
Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 7:21 am |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 6916
Location: "It's a Dry Heat."
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Quote: As it turns out, Moss is the only person (that we know of) who has managed to stand up to him at all I'm not sure I agree with your int-formation. There was at least one other person in the film who stood up to him and lived to tell.
Quote: The clerks all with that trademark Coen laconic drawl, and the back-and-forth dialogue that goes nowhere. Those were about the best parts of a film that was almost all best parts. Heck, I thought about noming Gene Jones for a supporting actor Blanche. I could watch that scene all day.
I wasn't troubled by Moss's going back with the water. Every movie is entitled to some suspension of disbelief, especially when it is at least plausibly linked to human nature. Heck, if I can accept Cordelia's inability to say "Luv ya pops," why not that Moss's conscience about leaving a man to die without even getting him water would bother him that much. |
_________________ I ask you, Velvel, as a rational man, which of us is possessed? |
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chillywilly |
Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:11 am |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 8251
Location: Salt Lake City
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whiskeypriest wrote: I wasn't troubled by Moss's going back with the water. Every movie is entitled to some suspension of disbelief, especially when it is at least plausibly linked to human nature. Heck, if I can accept Cordelia's inability to say "Luv ya pops," why not that Moss's conscience about leaving a man to die without even getting him water would bother him that much.
I thought when he went back to the scene with the water pretty much spelled out what kind of person he was. Knew his job, but had to go poke into something he didn't need to. I also think part of it was the bit of madness having all that money brought.
I really want to watch it again once it comes out on video. Seeing it on the big screen brought out the beauty of the cinema, but there were some parts that I could watch again on the small screen. |
_________________ Chilly
"If you should die before me / Ask if you could bring a friend" |
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jeremy |
Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:26 pm |
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Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 6794
Location: Derby, England and Hamilton, New Zealand (yes they are about 12,000 miles apart)
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I saw Sweeney Todd a few days ago. I enjoyed it, but I felt it didn't quite hit the heights, and can understand why it wasn't showered with the expected awards noms and wins.
In oppostion to just about everyone else, I felt one of the best things about it was Helena Bonham Carter's portrayal of Mrs Lovett. She was both funny, pathetic and, strangely, sexy. If they gave awards out for someone's beauty and sexuality shining through despite the best efforts of wadrobe, make-up and writers, HBC would win hands down. Whether ishe's playing a drug addict, witch, corpse or maker of unsavoury, savoury pies, she retains a certain something. Of course her big round eyes and good bone structure have a lot to do with it, but I also think a lot of it is down to the pure intelligence of her acting - Kristin Scott Thomas was another who had it. Tim Burton's insistance on showing off his wife's surprisingly ample bosom (she's only a slip of na thing after all) at every opportunity, made me smile...for a number of reason.
So why was Sweeney Todd just good rather than great. I'm not sure. I'll have to think on it a while. However, it may have had something to do with the confused tone. I think the film was meant to be more serious than the stage musical and wanted to use the medium to show or hint at more interior dialogue. However, the film had trouble reconciling this more serious approach with the humour and ridiculousness of the original inherent in the original production. |
_________________ I am angry, I am ill, and I'm as ugly as sin.
My irritability keeps me alive and kicking.
I know the meaning of life, it doesn't help me a bit.
I know beauty and I know a good thing when I see it. |
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jeremy |
Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:28 pm |
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Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 6794
Location: Derby, England and Hamilton, New Zealand (yes they are about 12,000 miles apart)
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Ghulam wrote: The French movie Lady Chatterley starring Marina Hands is based on a lesser known version of D.H.Lawrence' novel, and is a very mature treatment of the subject. It deals seriously with issues such as living as a paraplegic, living with a paraplegic, guilt-free commitment to a sexual relationship and the liberating effect of such a relationship. The complexity of the three main characters is well developed. The movie runs at a leisurely pace, is beautifully photographed, and deals with the sexual encounters in a tasteful manner. It won five Cesars, including Best Picture and Best Actress.
An underestimated and overlooked film, and a strange choice for a French filmmaker. |
_________________ I am angry, I am ill, and I'm as ugly as sin.
My irritability keeps me alive and kicking.
I know the meaning of life, it doesn't help me a bit.
I know beauty and I know a good thing when I see it. |
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Syd |
Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 1:18 pm |
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Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 12921
Location: Norman, Oklahoma
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jeremy: Nancy and I both praised Carter as well. More than Depp, as a matter of fact. |
_________________ I had a love and my love was true but I lost my love to the yabba dabba doo, --The Flintstone Lament |
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Joe Vitus |
Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 1:19 pm |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 14498
Location: Houston
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jeremy wrote: Ghulam wrote: The French movie Lady Chatterley starring Marina Hands is based on a lesser known version of D.H.Lawrence' novel, and is a very mature treatment of the subject. It deals seriously with issues such as living as a paraplegic, living with a paraplegic, guilt-free commitment to a sexual relationship and the liberating effect of such a relationship. The complexity of the three main characters is well developed. The movie runs at a leisurely pace, is beautifully photographed, and deals with the sexual encounters in a tasteful manner. It won five Cesars, including Best Picture and Best Actress.
An underestimated and overlooked film, and a strange choice for a French filmmaker.
It's based on the version now published as John Thomas and Lady Jane, no? I remember Andrew O'Hehir at Salon praising the movie, while having some reservations about the distinctly French flavor to this adaptation of a very British novel. Indeed, it was that clash of tones he described which, despite his praise, kept me away. Though I don't think he meant it as a criticism. |
_________________ You've got a great brain. You should keep it in your head.
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