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mo_flixx
Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2004 10:46 am Reply with quote
Joined: 30 May 2004 Posts: 12533
mo_flixx wrote:
Bocce -
Let me know if you'd like me to mail you my copy on VHS.


The offer is to EHLE. Sorry.
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mo_flixx
Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2004 10:47 am Reply with quote
Joined: 30 May 2004 Posts: 12533
...Or to anyone else who'd like to watch the VHS.
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ehle64
Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2004 10:48 am Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 7149 Location: NYC; US&A
Thanks, but I think that by the time I get it, this little forum will be archived. I appreciate the offer, though, and it's definitely going to be a movie that I'll tape if it ever comes on TCM.
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Ghulam
Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2004 12:20 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 4724 Location: Upstate NY
I rented it for a buck from "Hollywood".
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ehle64
Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 1:31 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 7149 Location: NYC; US&A
I finally got a DVD copy of The Men. It says it's the full-screen edition. Does anyone know if it, like A Place In The Sun, was originally filmed in those dimensions? Likewise, does anyone know of a site that tells you that kind of thing? I'm worried it's a pan and scan because there is a little box that says "this film has been formatted from its original version to fit your screen"! Thanks.
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marantzo
Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 1:42 pm Reply with quote
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ehle, I doubt that it was filmed in any kind of wide screen. It's like '51 or something. I could be wrong, but I don't remember wide screen on the mainstream films in those days.
ehle64
Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 1:55 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 7149 Location: NYC; US&A
Thanks, gary. IMDb says it was filmed in 1:37 aspect ratio and under the DVD Listings, it says Pan and Scan @ 1:33 aspect ratio. Probably won't lose much, I just don't understand why if they're going to release the thing on DVD, why not release it in it's original format!
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billyweeds
Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 5:18 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 20425 Location: New York City
Before we wrap this up, I have to strenuously disagree with the poster (can't remember who) who said the ending of The Sundowners was weak. To me, it's Zinnemann's strongest finale since High Noon--and, in fact, is strongly reminiscent of HN.

In both pictures, the climax is reached (obviously in HN it's way more arrantly dramatic) and then Zinnemann appends something which is SEEMINGLY just a coda, but in fact is another climax. In High Noon it's the throwing of the badge and the departure of the wagon. In The Sundowners it's the ineffably gorgeous shot of the herd moving on. Though the climax of HN is arguably the shootout and Miller's death, it's really the quieter, inexpressably sad and cynical fuck-you to the town by Cooper. Though the climax of The Sundowners is ostensibly the loss of the bet and the philosophical acceptance of the loss by the Carmodys (especially Ida), the real ending is the life-goes-on shot of the sheep.

In both High Noon and The Sundowners, Zinnemann uses the music in these final scenes as well as music can be used in movies.

These endings and the use of music in them cement High Noon and The Sundowners in my book as Zinnemann's two finest films.
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mo_flixx
Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 5:49 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 30 May 2004 Posts: 12533
I'm the person who felt the ending was weak. First of all, I'd like to know how the BOOK ended.
That's because I felt that the ending was tacked on -- or somehow changed.
My memory of how the movie ended was Mitchum, Kerr, Ustinov, and the kid all having a good laugh over the challenge to the outcome of the race. One of them says something about how it's good that they all have a sense of humor.

I liked the ending of HIGH NOON, btw.

Here's an example of a strong ending - IMO. THE SEARCHERS.
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mo_flixx
Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 5:52 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 30 May 2004 Posts: 12533
BTW although I saw THE SUNDOWNERS only a few weeks ago, I have completely forgotten the shot of the sheep! I had already gotten the point that "life goes on."

Take my memory lapse however you want.
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billyweeds
Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 6:23 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 20 May 2004 Posts: 20425 Location: New York City
mo_flixx wrote:
I'm the person who felt the ending was weak. First of all, I'd like to know how the BOOK ended.
That's because I felt that the ending was tacked on -- or somehow changed.
My memory of how the movie ended was Mitchum, Kerr, Ustinov, and the kid all having a good laugh over the challenge to the outcome of the race. One of them says something about how it's good that they all have a sense of humor.


And IMO that's a great ending in itself. Because for Ida to have a good laugh over the loss of something that was so important to her--having a permanent home--means SO MUCH MORE than "having a good sense of humor." True, it takes a little thought to get the deeper import, but the ending is strong and meaningful. Then...the shot you forget...the unique life they share, the natural beauty of Australia, the countryside, and most of all, the sheep. This is what they came within an inch of losing in the attempt to gain "respectability."
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bocce
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 5:30 am Reply with quote
Joined: 24 May 2004 Posts: 2428
billy...

while i'm less enthusiastic about "the sundowners" than you, i'll agree that it's a finely crafted film in all respects. zinnemann has a fine ear for melding the score with the action in all of his films.

in my opinion, the only two directors operating today that share this ear and overall attention to detail are scorsese and tavernier.
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marantzo
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 8:19 am Reply with quote
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I saw The Sundowners only once, when it was released. I remember liking it a lot, but not much else, except for the sheep shearing contest, which I remember vividly. I can still picture the veteran sheep shearer cleaning Mitchum's clock.
mo_flixx
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 9:25 am Reply with quote
Joined: 30 May 2004 Posts: 12533
billyweeds wrote:
mo_flixx wrote:
I'm the person who felt the ending was weak. First of all, I'd like to know how the BOOK ended.
That's because I felt that the ending was tacked on -- or somehow changed.
My memory of how the movie ended was Mitchum, Kerr, Ustinov, and the kid all having a good laugh over the challenge to the outcome of the race. One of them says something about how it's good that they all have a sense of humor.


And IMO that's a great ending in itself. Because for Ida to have a good laugh over the loss of something that was so important to her--having a permanent home--means SO MUCH MORE than "having a good sense of humor." True, it takes a little thought to get the deeper import, but the ending is strong and meaningful. Then...the shot you forget...the unique life they share, the natural beauty of Australia, the countryside, and most of all, the sheep. This is what they came within an inch of losing in the attempt to gain "respectability."


I thought that Ida had already "worked thru" the gambling loss the night before.
We are struck over and over thruout the movie how "plucky" (strong & resilient) she is.

I still think the ending seemed "tacked on."
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mo_flixx
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 9:26 am Reply with quote
Joined: 30 May 2004 Posts: 12533
P.S. Don't forget I felt that Kerr was miscast. I don't think she does "plucky" very well.
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