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| Rod |
 Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 7:20 am |
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Joined: 21 Dec 2004
Posts: 2944
Location: Lithgow, Australia
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Joe Vitus wrote: Don't understand the pans for Tim Burton's Batmans. I think it's a classic. Is it just that Burton is going through his period of neglet, the way so many good directors do? Will we have to wait another decade for people to come around and decided, Planet of the Apes or not, he did make a few good flicks?
I'll crawl over broken glass and eat shit - and I think I have done that in the past - to defend Burton at his best; Beetlejuice, Edward Scissorhands, Ed Wood, Sleepy Hollow, Big Fish, Corpse Bride, and, yes even, Sweeney Todd are all films that carefully balance their sense of the grotesque with a sense of love and adoration of warped humanity. Without this, the films of his I dislike most, including Batman Returns and Mars Attacks, his cartoonish violence just seems nasty (actually, that's what marks his Planet of the Apes as especially lousy amidst his oeuvre - it doesn't even have that). His Batman films are triumphs of AV pizzazz but badly lack dramatic depth. It's clear that Burton felt no love for the characters in those films except, possibly, for Catwoman.
That said, maybe it's time I watched them again. |
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| billyweeds |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 7:45 am |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 20618
Location: New York City
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| My favorite Burton films are Ed Wood, Beetlejuice, and Batman--in that order. (Not Batman Returns). Sleepy Hollow and Planet of the Apes are two of his worst IMO. Just goes to show you that opinions vary. In any case, I think Burton comes up quite a bit ahead of Nolan, at least thus far in their respective careers. (I have never been nearly as enamored of Memento as some filmic gurus say I should be.) |
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| Rod |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 8:05 am |
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Joined: 21 Dec 2004
Posts: 2944
Location: Lithgow, Australia
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| Memento is the cinematic equivalent of a three-card monte trick. After all the slight of hand is finished, you lose your ten bucks. Seriously, it was a tedious gimmick with very little to say. I was glad when it was over. |
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A long time ago, but somehow in the future...It is a period of civil war and renegade paragraphs floating through space. |
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| billyweeds |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 8:08 am |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
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Location: New York City
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Rod wrote: Memento is the cinematic equivalent of a three-card monte trick. After all the slight of hand is finished, you lose your ten bucks. Seriously, it was a tedious gimmick with very little to say. I was glad when it was over.
Glad to see someone else agrees with me. |
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| whiskeypriest |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 8:18 am |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 6916
Location: "It's a Dry Heat."
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billyweeds wrote: Rod wrote: Memento is the cinematic equivalent of a three-card monte trick. After all the slight of hand is finished, you lose your ten bucks. Seriously, it was a tedious gimmick with very little to say. I was glad when it was over.
Glad to see someone else agrees with me.
Also, I don't really like any of Tim Burton's films that much. I find them cold-hearted and incredibly mannered. Though granted, as with David Lynch, I have stopped going to his movies on the grounds that I have better uses for my money than proving that hope triumphs over experience in more than just second marriages. |
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| billyweeds |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 8:38 am |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
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Location: New York City
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| whiskey--I certainly can understand your reluctance to spend your hard-earned cash on the Burton brand. His last really good movie--though it was really good--was Ed Wood, way back in 1994. |
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| marantzo |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 9:43 am |
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Quote:
Don't understand the pans for Tim Burton's Batmans. I think it's a classic. Is it just that Burton is going through his period of neglet, the way so many good directors do? Will we have to wait another decade for people to come around and decided, Planet of the Apes or not, he did make a few good flicks?
I agree except I am the one person in the world who liked his Planet of the Apes. |
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| marantzo |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 9:47 am |
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| I couldn't stand Big Fish. And I'm a Burton fan. |
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| Syd |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 10:10 am |
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Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 12921
Location: Norman, Oklahoma
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billyweeds wrote: I agree wholeheartedly about the boring, almost unwatchable Batman Begins, and can't begin to understand what all the shouting was about.
That said, I'm certainly going to be in attendance at The Dark Knight, which sounds different (more exciting, more violent, better acted). I will see it in IMAX.
I really liked Batman Begins. Christian Bale was superb in the role and I liked that they made the villain the Scarecrow rather than one of the more obvious opponents. One of the problems the Spider-Man movies had was using up the two best opponents in the first two movies. Venom and the Sandman pale beside Alfred Molina's Dr. Octopus. |
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| Kate |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 10:38 am |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
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Location: Pacific Northwest
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| We saw Hellboy II last night and I liked it, but not as much as the first one. Guillermo del Toro is an interesting director and I like his work so far (I loved Blade II, for me a good example of a very good sequel) - but many of the creatures in Hellboy were very similar to the ones in Pan's Labyrynth - so much so that it was distracting to me. It was very entertaining nonetheless, maybe not quite as funny as the first one, but good solid entertainment. |
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| ehle64 |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:22 am |
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Joined: 20 May 2004
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Location: NYC; US&A
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i loved batman begins & have never seen hellboy, but loved pan's labyrinth and will definitely try & see the dark night *with my beloved heath* today.
thanks for the review, kate! |
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| seagull |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:34 am |
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Joined: 11 Jul 2008
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Location: Philadelphia PA
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I think people that pan Dark Knight have never read a comic book in their life.
While I Do think Heath ledger was slightly more than workmanlike in his joker (restrained, one mustn't speak ill of dead comic book super villains) and do not think the film or Chris Nolan broke any original ground, I think it was faithful to convention and was reasonably enjoyable if you went with people that appreciate that kind of thing..
Wish Maggie Gyllenhal had a bigger role , but nobody could. It was a superhero flic. |
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| marantzo |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:49 am |
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ehle64 wrote: i loved batman begins & have never seen hellboy, but loved pan's labyrinth and will definitely try & see the dark night *with my beloved heath* today.
thanks for the review, kate!
Wade, you should see Hellboy. I think you would like it. I loved it. I haven't seen the sequel yet. I might catch it this afternoon. |
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| gromit |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 12:09 pm |
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Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 9010
Location: Shanghai
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Fully enjoyed all three of my viewings of Memento. Somewhat of a modern classic.
About the only neo-noir of the last 20 years that I like.
I liked Hellboy, but didn't think it was good enough for a sequel. I'd rather watch the first one again, then try Part II.
I've never seen any of the Batman films, but did participate in busts of pirated Batman goods (mostly t-shirts) on the hot streets of NYC, for two days one summer. I was a summer associate at a law firm representing the rights holder, and I stood there in a semi-pricey suit on a hot day, looking like a complete schmuck, while some police harassed street vendors. The second day, I wandered off after an hour or two, mumbling that I needed to get back to the office, but really heading for Central Park greenery. |
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| marantzo |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 12:34 pm |
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| I'm a big fan of Memento. To me it was a wonderful weird treat. And it was very funny in places. The final scene was marvelous. |
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